[Ben Holmes]

Dale Hayes Wrote:MM doesn't respond to my posts so would somebody inquire of him why the plotters decided to shoot Kennedy from the front while framing their patsy as shooting from the rear, necessitating the altering of the Z-film, surgically altering the President's wounds, the planting of evidence and the falsification of records? If the sixth floor window was staged, why were the hulls subsequently moved along with the boxes in the window? It seems these plotters were simultaneously incredibly stupid and brilliant - they fooled every independent body to examine this case but went about their crime in a completely nonsensical manner. Of course, the answer is that there were no plotters and NO plot. No credible evidence of a plot has been posted in this forum.

Dale has been repeatedly told that his strawman of "the plotters decided to shoot Kennedy from the front while framing their patsy as shooting from the rear"is absolute nonsense... and has no evidence to support it.

Yet he just keeps right on spouting it year after year...

What does it take for a believer to drop factoids?

Dale Hayes Wrote:If the sixth floor window was staged, why were the hulls subsequently moved along with the boxes in the window?

David Von Pein Wrote:Some conspiracy theorists think the police moved the boxes in the sniper's nest prior to the boxes being photographed.

This provably happened... if Dale and David would read the testimony, he would know that the boxes were moved many times, and that the hulls were never photographed in their original positions. This is simply historical fact.

Tom Alyea Wrote:Det. Studebaker was alone at this site until after Lt. Day left eh building with the rifle. We in the search team went to the sniper's site. The barricade had been completely dismantled and the boxes from the West side of the barricade had been removed and placed in various locations around the site. We did not realize at the time that Studebaker had not recorded on film the original placement of the boxes in the barricade. He also had removed the shooting support boxes on the window ledge and stacked them one on top of the other on the floor inside. He took a picture of this reconstructed arrangement. This is the view researchers have of the shooting support boxes that were originally on the brick window ledge. The corner of the outside box was positioned over the lower window channel that tilted the box at an angle.

Capt. Fritz had seen the photographs and had directed the crime lab to correct the shots of the window boxes and the casings on the floor. He had seen the original placement and ordered the crime lab to correct it. Neither Lt. Day nor Det. Studebaker had seen the original placement, so they procured my film from the TV station to get it right. The high angle shot[s] were made to show the original placement. Their reconstruction was close, but not exact. However, they did not bring the casings with them so they did not make the correction of the original placement of the shell casings.

(Interested readers can find these Alyea quotes in 'Enemy of the Truth' by Sherry Fiester, along with much more evidence that the scene was not photographed as it originally was.)

The question remains... why do believers keep stating the same, disproven factoids year after year?

[Patrick C]

"If the sixth floor window was staged, why were the hulls subsequently moved along with the boxes in the window?"

The boxes were not moved Ben before the cops arrived on the 6th floor if that is what you mean....

the Dillard and Powell photos prove that as per DVP's little motion pic he linked us all to on Amazon.

That they were moved later....of course they well have been and according to Tom Alyea, they were.

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:

Quote:If the sixth floor window was staged, why were the hulls subsequently moved along with the boxes in the window?

The boxes were not moved Ben before the cops arrived on the 6th floor if that is what you mean....

the Dillard and Powell photos prove that as per DVP's little motion pic he linked us all to on Amazon.

That they were moved later....of course they well have been and according to Tom Alyea, they were.

The topic is whether or not the crime scene was photographed in situ. It was not.

The argument about boxes being moved prior to officers arriving on the 6th floor also has evidence for it, as you're well aware.

Are you willing to publicly state that the DPD had extremely poor onsite investigatory skills? Even by 1963 standards?

[Patrick C]

Ben Holmes Wrote:Are you willing to publicly state that the DPD had extremely poor onsite investigatory skills? Even by 1963 standards?

Well I cannot be an expert judge on that, but for what it is worth it certainly seems they were pretty derelict at preserving the crime scene ref the snipers nest.

On the other hand the DPD had their killer in custody withing 2 hours approx and had the assassin charged by around midnight, so that was pretty good. In contrast to James Earl Ray who was arrested in England......

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:

Ben Holmes Wrote:Are you willing to publicly state that the DPD had extremely poor onsite investigatory skills? Even by 1963 standards?

Well I cannot be an expert judge on that, but for what it is worth it certainly seems they were pretty derelict at preserving the crime scene ref the snipers nest.

Dodge a bullet on that one... I had my 5th Edition of "Modern Criminal Investigation, published in 1962 - ready to go...

Patrick C Wrote:On the other hand the DPD had their killer in custody withing 2 hours approx and had the assassin charged by around midnight, so that was pretty good. In contrast to James Earl Ray who was arrested in England......

You mean, of course, that they had a suspect in custody. There has never been a trial, and even you would admit that no defense was even allowed during the Warren Commission...

If guilt were identical with prosecution - America wouldn't be a Republic.