[Ben Holmes]

One of the first policemen that poured into the Grassy Knoll area immediately after the last shots were fired was Patrolman Joe Smith, who had rushed into the parking lot behind the fence because a women had told him that the shots had come "from the bushes." From his testimony:

Quote:... and this woman came up to me and she was just in hysterics. She told me, "They are shooting the President from the bushes." So I immediately proceeded up here.

Interestingly, in his testimony he also places the sound of the shots as coming from the Grassy Knoll - although by the time of his testimony he ascribes it to an "echo". Funny also, that he didn't mention the fact that he'd smelled gunpowder. But it's not exactly a secret that many eyewitnesses were carefully coached prior to their testimony.

But the most interesting point is the "Secret Service Agent" that he'd encountered, exactly where many eyewitnesses and the HSCA put a gunman:

Quote:Mr SMITH: Yes, sir; I checked all the cars. I looked into all the cars and checked around the bushes. Of course, I wasn't alone. There was some deputy sheriff with me, and I believe one Secret Service man when I got there. I got to make this statement, too. I felt awfully silly, but after the shot and this woman, I pulled my pistol from my holster, and I thought, this is silly, I don't know who I am looking for, and I put it back. Just as I did, he showed me that he was a Secret Service agent.
Mr. LIEBELER: Did you accost this man?
Mr. SMITH: Well, he saw me coming with my pistol and right away he showed me who he was.
Mr. LIEBELER: Do you remember who it was?
Mr. SMITH: No, sir; I don't--because then we started checking the cars.

From Anthony Summer's book, Conspiracy:

Quote:Secret Service agents, in 1963, were the essence of the crewcut, besuited American young man. The man encountered in the parking lot was different. As Officer Smith puts it, "He look like an auto mechanic. He had on a sports shirt and a sports pants. But he had dirty fingernails, it looked like, and hands that looked like an auto mechanic's hands. And afterwards it didn't ring true for the Secret Service. (Pg. 81)

Of course, we know know that there were no legitimate Secret Service agents on the Grassy Knoll. Besides Officer Smith and the unnamed Deputy Sheriff that was with him, others also saw this man... Gorden Arnold, Jean Hill, and officer John Tilson. (Tilson actually gave chase when this unknown man got into a black car, and went speeding off... Tilson actually got the license number before losing the suspect - but like so much evidence in this case, it simply disappeared).

Often, believers are fond of arguing that no other gunmen were seen, yet the facts are quite different. Someone producing false "Secret Service" identification argues for a conspiracy that was planned far in advance, and this bit of evidence for conspiracy might never have been noticed - until it was discovered that no Secret Service agents remained in Dealey Plaza after the shooting.

Another false "Secret Service" sighting was right behind the TSBD...

Quote:Mr. BELIN - Then you went around to the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Was anyone around in the back when you got there?
Mr. HARKNESS - There were some Secret Service agents there. I didn't get them identified. They told me they were Secret Service.

They weren't, of course. Who were they?

Why were so many "Secret Service" agents in Dealey Plaza? We have at least 3 men claiming to be Secret Service agents, yet we KNOW that they aren't. Trying to develop a non-conspiratorial explanation for these impostors has proven to be quite difficult for the believer's crowd...

For further information, here's one attempt, and it's rebuttal:

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/ljohns.txt
http://www.jfklancer.com/ManWho.html

[Patrick C]

So Smith must have been one of 35% approx who thought ALL the shots came from the Knoll....a view which is known to be wrong.

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:So Smith must have been one of 35% approx who thought ALL the shots came from the Knoll....a view which is known to be wrong.

My crystal ball is telling me that Patrick will decline to defend this incorrect tabulation...

As he has in the past...

[Patrick C]

Nope, a small fraction of the witnesses Ben stated two sources for the shots.

Those that thought all the shots came from front are clearly wrong.

It is that simple.....

There was no shot from the front, it is just nonsense....a complete red herring...

I really struggle to accept how any of you buy into that theory, it's a load of crap.

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:Nope, a small fraction of the witnesses Ben stated two sources for the shots.

Those that thought all the shots came from front are clearly wrong.

It is that simple.....

There was no shot from the front, it is just nonsense....a complete red herring...

I really struggle to accept how any of you buy into that theory, it's a load of crap.

Once again Patrick refuses to defend the false McAdams tabulation he keeps using.

My crystal ball was, as usual; absolutely correct.

[Ben Holmes]

For Patrick - or any other believer who wishes to roll the dice...



If I asked you to locate the direction of the railroad yards adjacent to the TSBD, from what time to what time would be the direction that would encompass the railroad yards?

For example, the overpass would be roughly 6:30 to 7:30.

Or the bright flare on the railroad tracks to the left of the building would be a tad before 9. (Say... 8:45 or so...)

I'm not interested in minute accuracy, I'm interested in the direction from the center of the clock... where you position the railroad yard.

Full Disclosure - the center of the clock is at the front entrance of the TSBD.

[David Healy]

7:00 to 12:00+

[Ben Holmes]

David Healy Wrote:7:00 to 12:00+

I'll have to wait for the WCR Supporters to chime in before I go further with this.

[Patrick C]

Nobody. Nobody and Nobody.....

Unless you count the three people at the base of the steps one of which is Gordon Arnold.

[Patrick C]

Around 8 to 10...