[Nick Principe]

Why is it LNers simply ignore this part of Markham's testimony:

Mr. BALL. So you were walking south toward Jefferson?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. You think it was a little after 1?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I wouldn't be afraid to bet it wasn't 6 or 7 minutes after 1.
Mr. BALL. You know what time you usually get your bus, don't you?
Mrs. MARKHAM. 1:15.
Mr. BALL. So it was before 1:15?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Yes, it was.

It is not reasonable to assume she got the time wrong, since she was en route to work and knew when her daily bus was scheduled to arrive. This puts the timeline of the WC's version of Tippit's slaying in quite a conundrum. Oswaldists don't touch this one.

[Garry Puffer]

The following come from a website called "JFK Assassination-From Both Sides," a site which. alas, seems to no longer exist.

I know the thread is concerned with Mrs. Markham's testimony, but I post these because they buttress her testimony as far as the time of shooting goes.

Barbara Jeanette Davis signed an affidavit on November 22nd that she heard two shots "shortly after 1 PM"
Ted Callaway signed an affidavit on November 22nd that he heard some shots "about 1 PM"

Mrs. Margie Higgins of 417 East 10th Street said that "I just looked up at the clock on my television to verify the time and it said 1:06. At that point I heard the shots."

Sam Guinyard signed an affidavit on November 22nd that he heard some shooting "about 1 PM" near Patton and 10th Street

On January 21st 1964, Elbert Austin signed an affidavit saying that "sometime after 1:00 PM" he heard approximately two or three shots and saw a policeman lying in front of a police car on the left front side.

On January 21st 1964, Francis Kinneth signed an affidavit saying that "at approximately 1:00 PM" he heard approximately two or three shots and saw a parked police car and a uniform police officer lying on the ground.

Frank Cimino signed an affidavit on December 3rd that "at about 1:00 PM" he heard four loud noises which sounded like shots.

Dallas County Sheriff's Deputy Roger Craig claims he looked at his watch upon hearing of the Tippit shooting, and saw the time was 1:06.


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[Patrick C]

Well, it is odd I would accept on the face of it, but people tend not to remember exact timings. After the fact I would suggest that people tend to work in quarter of an hour slots and they can easily be out.

If it is true that Tippit was shot earlier than the official WC version then Oswald must have got a ride / lift to the 10th and Patton scene.

Ted Calloway was sure the man who ran by him muttering "poor dumb (or damn) cop" was Oswald......

Personally I think there is more doubt over the JFK killing than Tippit when it comes to Oswald's guilt.

[Ray Mitcham]

T.F.Bowley
"On Friday November 22, 1963 I picked up my daughter at the R. L. Thornton School in Singing Hills at about 12:55 pm. I then left the school to pick up my wife who was at work at the Telephone Company at Ninth Street and Zangs Street. I was headed north on Marsalis and turned west on 10th Street. I traveled about a block and noticed a Dallas police squad car stopped in the traffic lane headed east on 10th Street. I saw a police officer lying next to the left front wheel. I stopped my car and got out to go to the scene. I looked at my watch and it said 1:10 pm."

Bowley wasn't working in "quarter of an hour slots".

If Oswald was given a lift, then wouldn't that mean a conspiracy, as nobody has come forward to claim same?

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:Well, it is odd I would accept on the face of it, but people tend not to remember exact timings. After the fact I would suggest that people tend to work in quarter of an hour slots and they can easily be out."

Speculation won't work to over-ride the actual testimony... several witnesses had specific reasons to remember the time.

Patrick C Wrote:If it is true that Tippit was shot earlier than the official WC version then Oswald must have got a ride / lift to the 10th and Patton scene.

This is the faith that believers have... the Warren Commission's conclusion that Lee Harvey Oswald ALONE shot JFK must be true - so when the facts don't add up, simply change the facts.

Patrick C Wrote:Ted Calloway was sure the man who ran by him muttering "poor dumb (or damn) cop" was Oswald......

Mr. BENAVIDES. And so Ted then got in the taxicab and the taxicab came to a halt and he asked me which way he went. I told him he went down Patton Street toward the office, and come to find out later Ted had already seen him go by there.

Patrick C Wrote:Personally I think there is more doubt over the JFK killing than Tippit when it comes to Oswald's guilt.

Personally, I think that someone who cannot admit a single problem or lie in the entire case evidence has a faith far stronger than the Pope.

[Garry Puffer]

Patrick C Wrote:If it is true that Tippit was shot earlier than the official WC version then Oswald must have got a ride / lift to the 10th and Patton scene.

Then why did the WC have to lie about the time of the shooting? Why not just speculate that Oswald got a ride?

You do understand that you are begging the question here, right, Patrick? Why does it not seem possible to you that all these people were correct about the time and that Oswald did not kill Tippit? All that "solid" evidence really isn't all that solid if you consider that a great effort was being made to frame Oswald.

The evidence says that Oswald could not have been at the Tippit murder scene in time and also that the WC flat out lied about the time of the shooting to make the impossible appear possible.

Why do you accept this WC fabrication?


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[Patrick C]

I can't agree Garry, I think people are poor time keepers and the time of the shooting could well have been closer to 115pm.

I do accept completely that the WC report should have highlighted concerns over the timings.

I am convinced Oswald attempted to shoot Nick McDonald in the TT...and Brewer saw Oswald duck into his store because of the cop cars racing to the Tippit scene....the idea that Oswald was already in the theatre is plain bonkers, otherwise Brewer would not have seen him walk by......

You can do the walk from the rooming house to the Tippit scene in 11 minutes walking - I did it aged 23 approx....

You could get there quicker if you did a walk / jog and there is no reason to count that out on Oswald's part.

I am not suspicious of the Dallas police AT ALL in the entire case. I think they did a good job other than the crime scene shells which were probably moved. They may have made mistakes of course - after all it placed them in the centre of the biggest storm since WW2 probably.

[Ben Holmes]

Patrick C Wrote:I am not suspicious of the Dallas police AT ALL in the entire case. I think they did a good job other than the crime scene shells which were probably moved.

They failed to follow 1963 standards for a crime scene - their "investigation" was so bumbling and wrong that there are a number of officers who should lose their jobs.

You have to have true faith to believe in the Dallas PD.

[Lee Abbott]

Patrick C says he "isn't suspicious of the Dallas police AT ALL in the entire case. I think they did a good job other than the crime scene shells which were probably moved."

And I assume you feel their "good work" includes the murder of the suspect in JFK's assassination, along with killing of one of their own (Tippit)..?

Unfortunately, and Patrick C is among the most learned in this matter, developing blindness to reality is a symptom from which all believers inevitably suffer.

[Garry Puffer]

Patrick C Wrote:I can't agree Garry, I think people are poor time keepers and the time of the shooting could well have been closer to 115pm.

Even though you have eight people saying it was closer to one o'clock and no one stating it was later than 1:10? On what exactly do you base your disagreement?

I do accept completely that the WC report should have highlighted concerns over the timings.

So this is the kind of disagreement you have with the Warren Report?

I am convinced Oswald attempted to shoot Nick McDonald in the TT...and Brewer saw Oswald duck into his store because of the cop cars racing to the Tippit scene....the idea that Oswald was already in the theatre is plain bonkers, otherwise Brewer would not have seen him walk by......

So Butch Burroughs is a liar and the people who saw a man taken out the rear of the theater are just mistaken?

You can do the walk from the rooming house to the Tippit scene in 11 minutes walking - I did it aged 23 approx....

You could get there quicker if you did a walk / jog and there is no reason to count that out on Oswald's part.

What was Belin's time again? And a walk/jog would still take more than a few minutes. I have to remind you here once again that the evidence says the shooting was close to 1:06, not 1:16.

I am not suspicious of the Dallas police AT ALL in the entire case. I think they did a good job other than the crime scene shells which were probably moved. They may have made mistakes of course - after all it placed them in the centre of the biggest storm since WW2 probably.

This last statement is so naive that I don't know how to respond to it.


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